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-   -   EZ-One vs Table Saw (http://tracksawforum.com/showthread.php?t=4886)

RED 10-04-2017 08:54 PM

EZ-One vs Table Saw
 
Wasn't sure where to post this, so here I am. I did research two or three years ago trying to decide whether to get a new table saw, go the Festool route or go with Eurekazone products. I've had a couple of serious kickbacks using table saws, and really prefer a different route. I chose Festool back in 2015, but found that system slow, tedious and, of course, expensive. I used to rough cut sheet goods, then take the cutoffs to the table saw to square up and cut to final dimensions. I had very little waste, and the process was very quick. Then I had the kickbacks sending me to the hospital followed by weeks of physical therapy. When I tried to cut sheet goods down to final dimensions with Festool I had a great deal of trouble getting things as square as I wanted. I bought some accessories to help with that, and they worked well. However, it took forever compared to a table saw. I got so fed up with it, I sold all the Festool products and accessories I had. I'm now back to deciding between another tablesaw (don't really like that idea) and Eurekazone. I still don't see how EZ can match a table saw for ripping 8' 1x4 lumber, for example, down to 1" strips. Also, aside from marking two ends of 8' plywood and positioning the track on the marks (leads to inaccurate cuts), how do you rip plywood accurately? I know about the UEG, but how accurate is it? I've read where it's a pain to go back and forth from the UEG to track use. I've also read where the EZ-One has to be adjusted frequently to keep the cuts square. In addition, it seems that work table is expensive for a few pieces of extruded aluminum. I want to like the EZ product line, but after being bitten by a table saw and losing money on Festool products, I want to be sure this time before investing in it. Anyone have any advice they'd be willing to share?

philb 10-04-2017 10:15 PM

Rip on a bandsaw
 
Not sure I understand how and what you want to do -- but If I have the right image, I would not be doing these cuts on anything but a band saw. Just like a table saw you can build support tables. that will let you rip the wood in a lengthwise manner. None the less you can also use the multiform table package and a saber saw (Jigsaw). I have a Bosch industrial that with the right blade will go every bit as fast as a circular saw. The band saw is the faster option if you are making lots of that type of cut. Building a table surround and set the fence in place, use a fast cut blade and you are off and running. I have done the same and finished planing the sides for a smooth finish cut. When I build a bunch of cabinets, I have face frame pieces to mill out. When you need it you will have a band saw for those odd to make cuts.
Sorry I do not have any photos, and still in the process of moving, so my shop is a long way from set up.

Tracedfar 10-04-2017 11:20 PM

I had a similar choice and concerns regarding long rips and squaring up panels. I chose EZSmart and have been very happy.

Like you experienced with Festool, it requires a different approach. For example, cross cuts before rips. Once I got my mind around it, my work is as fast or faster and much safer.

Regarding a couple of your other concerns:

The UEG really is easier, faster, safer, and more accurate for breaking down sheet goods, especially for a one man operation like mine. I recommend a dedicated saw for it if you regularly break down sheet goods. (Also, a centipede sawhorse) I won't ever go back to manhandling plywood across a table saw again.

For the money, you can't build a table that is as versatile as the EZ1, especially with folding legs. The sliding rails and adjustable stops make it infinitely more versatile than anything else out there. I tried to spec out a portable aluminum table and quickly realized the value of the EZ1.

As for repeatable accuracy, the only way I could improve my EZSmart is to somehow incorporate an Incra LS into it. Frankly, once you square your rail and set your stops, it's dead on until you change it. Great for repetitive work.

I'm still tempted by Sawstop and Euro sliders but, when reality sets in, EZSmart is not only safer but easier on the wallet. And we haven't even discussed the routing capabilities!

It's not perfect, nor is it the last tool I'll ever need but my work is safe, efficient, and profitable.

I suggest watching the YouTube videos if you haven't already done so.

RED 10-05-2017 01:36 PM

I appreciate the responses so far, but I'm still a little skeptical about investing in this system. The website has a tab for weekly specials, but I have not seen anything there since I've begun seriously considering EZ. Also, some of their packages are more expensive than simply buying the pieces individually. The latest one, for example, is the table with the folding legs and the ultimate clamping set, with shipping. The shipping would have to be over $100 for that package to save you any money. It just doesn't seem the company puts much thought into their business plan or website. That makes me wonder if this company is about to go under. Again, I really want to like this system, but I'm looking at a $1000 to $2000 investment. That's a lot of money to me, and it'd buy a nice Grizzly cabinet table saw. I know I can accomplish what I want to do using a table saw. The EZ system and business are still unknows to me.

sean9c 10-05-2017 03:09 PM

How are you going to cut up panels on a bandsaw? Has to be a really deep throated one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by philb (Post 39328)
Not sure I understand how and what you want to do -- but If I have the right image, I would not be doing these cuts on anything but a band saw. Just like a table saw you can build support tables. that will let you rip the wood in a lengthwise manner. None the less you can also use the multiform table package and a saber saw (Jigsaw). I have a Bosch industrial that with the right blade will go every bit as fast as a circular saw. The band saw is the faster option if you are making lots of that type of cut. Building a table surround and set the fence in place, use a fast cut blade and you are off and running. I have done the same and finished planing the sides for a smooth finish cut. When I build a bunch of cabinets, I have face frame pieces to mill out. When you need it you will have a band saw for those odd to make cuts.
Sorry I do not have any photos, and still in the process of moving, so my shop is a long way from set up.


sean9c 10-05-2017 03:33 PM

Never understood guys that cut up panels first with a tracksaw and then recut with a table saw. Pick one or the other, either used correctly should give you accurate cuts.
Don't know what you were doing with Festool, it should have worked. If you were marking panels and setting your tracks to marks it won't work, it doesn't matter what system. You will not get repeat accurate cuts. You need to be setting up to hard stops.
UEG works great. That takes care of your rip cuts. You need to be able to index off a straight edge. Have a dedicated saw in your UEG, saws just aren't that expensive.
Crosscuts are a little more difficult, the EZ1 would do them well if you can afford it. Theoretically the ideal tool is the EZ Cabinetmaker but in practicality it's finicky, where it is let down is that it uses the EZ Square. If set up and handled correctly it works OK.
You want to rip 1" wide strips from a 8ft 1x4? You could do it using EZ stuff but it's slow unless you take time and make a setup to do it. IMO you won't beat a TS for that.
What's the best for you? That's up to you. EZ will do all you need but there will be a learning curve and you might have to get creative.
A TS is pretty much guaranteed to do all you want, but if you're scared of it that's a problem. Also for a TS to cut panels efficiently you'll need infeed, outfeed and side support tables. So, with all that it'd probably be 8ft wide and 12ft long. You have to have the space to dedicate to it.


Quote:

Originally Posted by RED (Post 39330)
I appreciate the responses so far, but I'm still a little skeptical about investing in this system. The website has a tab for weekly specials, but I have not seen anything there since I've begun seriously considering EZ. Also, some of their packages are more expensive than simply buying the pieces individually. The latest one, for example, is the table with the folding legs and the ultimate clamping set, with shipping. The shipping would have to be over $100 for that package to save you any money. It just doesn't seem the company puts much thought into their business plan or website. That makes me wonder if this company is about to go under. Again, I really want to like this system, but I'm looking at a $1000 to $2000 investment. That's a lot of money to me, and it'd buy a nice Grizzly cabinet table saw. I know I can accomplish what I want to do using a table saw. The EZ system and business are still unknows to me.


philb 10-05-2017 03:33 PM

I was not complete in explaining.
 
Sorry! I read the part about where he could not understand how to rip 1 inch strips from 8' 1"X 4" lumber. I was referring to that question. I should have been clearer as to what part of the question I was answering. The band saw is how I solved the problem.
Many of my approaches are not the same as other woodworkers. The problem with me is that I am disabled. Part of the time I work from a wheel chair, some times not. My left arm is useless for most things, and now I have a canted neck that will not support my head completely. I use EZ because I am able to make it bend to my will. I can work regardless of the challenges. If my methods seem a bit odd -- well I guess all of me and my methods are odd.:) I dislike the UEG because I can not find a way to operate it with one hand. The EZ system has lots of ways I can clamp, hold cut and work. The table saw is just not a good option so I do things the way I can. I guess that defines us. We want things the way we want them and will not compromise -- including me.

Mike Goetzke 10-05-2017 06:06 PM

Red- I was one of the first users of EZ. Must have had almost all of their products. I have settled on UEG, Square, and long rail. I actually sold a 3 year old Uni trying to do w/o a table saw but couldn't do it. I now added a 1950 Uni to the shop for cuts requiring a TS, but, I do use several safety devices - SharkGuard w/splitter, Jessem stock guides, Grr-ripper push blocks, push sticks, and a clear head.

Mike

Tracedfar 10-06-2017 12:25 AM

So, a guy who uses a 67 year old cabinet saw is one of the first to adopt the EZSmart system. There's a lesson, a joke, or something in there somewhere.

Thanks Mike! I really needed the encouragement today!

T

kenk 10-06-2017 03:49 PM

RED,

There is a Rebuilding Sale going on right now.

Pairing the saw with the UEG is really pretty quick. I store mine separately even though I have a saw dedicated to the UEG. I'd suggest using two equal length spacer blocks to make setting up the UEG more accurate and easier if you need to repeatedly rip the same widths. Yeah, its not as simple as setting a very expensive table saw fence - but my cheap table saw required checking parallelness (word?) to the miter slot every time, so nothing new for me.

The EZ-One does not require frequent squaring. The squared setting is held in place by four connector extrusions on the end SSME extrusions, and they simply don't move. Heck, if bumped VERY hard you're more likely to damage the B300 arms or extrusions than you are to move the B300 position on the SSME extrusions.

I can't speak to the perceived value of the Eurekazone tools. I myself am heavily and happily invested in several guide rails, most if not all of the clamping tools, the older Smart Square, the Super Smart Router Kit (SSRK), a Smart Table, the UEG, Repeaters, two EZ Ready saws, and the EZ-One. No regrets ... and no table saw. Well, OK, I have a 25 year old cheap Skill table saw sitting in my garage, but I have not used it since buying my first EZ Smart guide rail in 2008.

If you're worried about Eurekazone going out of business then buy a lifetime supply of anti-chip edges and inserts. Everything else is truly industrial quality and will easily outlive me - and still look clean and shiny ... well extruded aluminum shiny, not chrome shiny. The only other replacement part I've ever purchased was a new EZ-One depth guide, because the previous owner of my pre-driven EZ-One accidentally cut into it ... and I wanted a non-customized depth stop. The cut in no way reduced the depth stop's capability - actually it emphasized its role.

Oh, the only way to rip 8'x1"x4" lumber the EZ Smart way that I now of is to (1) use the EZ Smart Clamp System on a long length of guide rail (suggest using two spacer blocks for fast placement), OR (2) use an EZ-One Max (which provides amazing ripping capability). I'd use option (1) with spacer blocks - not too bad.

That Grizzly table saw will still have a risk of kickback. EZ Smart will protect your fingers - and other body parts!! ... and is MUCH more portable ... and will probably last much longer. It is really pretty easy to swap out circular saws or routers, if needed - though I'd suggest buying a new Smart Base for each new circular saw - for the best and easiest placement of the blade.

I'm pretty sure that my EZ Smart tools will still look new the day I leave this earth as it was the day I bought it. I just hope my kids realized how amazing these odd looking aluminum tools are ... or at the very least some lucky schmuck browsing through the local Goodwill will realize what they've found for $15. I feel the same way about my semi-custom Doug Ritter knives - which are now ending production ... if any of you are knife fans like me.

Ken K.


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