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  #1  
Old 01-28-2018, 07:53 PM
Absinthe Absinthe is offline
 
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Posts: 268
Default Chinese Knockoffs on Ebay (look lik EZ with center guide)

I was looking around eBay and came across Chinese sourced tracksaw system with universal saw base. The track itself reminds me of the EZ configuration. Patent infringements?
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  #2  
Old 01-29-2018, 04:33 PM
whitejacket whitejacket is offline
 
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Location: Illinois
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I discovered this a couple weeks ago doing a search for a router table fence. This seller on Ebay (http://stores.ebay.com/Smartool-Plus...p2047675.l2563) has numerous EZSMART knock-off products (UEG, Smart Base, EZ-One like table without bridge or sliding fences, and SSRK). I emailed Dino about it a couple weeks ago to let him know these existed.

Joe
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  #3  
Old 01-29-2018, 05:00 PM
Absinthe Absinthe is offline
 
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How much of the product line is actually patented?
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Old 01-29-2018, 06:06 PM
tofu tofu is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitejacket View Post
I discovered this a couple weeks ago doing a search for a router table fence. This seller on Ebay (http://stores.ebay.com/Smartool-Plus...p2047675.l2563) has numerous EZSMART knock-off products (UEG, Smart Base, EZ-One like table without bridge or sliding fences, and SSRK). I emailed Dino about it a couple weeks ago to let him know these existed.

Joe
without the bridge and sliding ssme, it's even more expensive than an ez-one
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  #5  
Old 01-29-2018, 06:41 PM
Wendell Terrell Wendell Terrell is offline
 
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I informed both Customer Service and Dino about this on July 1st last year, requested a followup report and never heard anything, it's almost like they aren't interested.
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  #6  
Old 01-29-2018, 06:44 PM
whitejacket whitejacket is offline
 
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There is probably not a lot that can be done considering that even Lego can't keep counterfeiters from selling products under the Lepin name.

Joe
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  #7  
Old 01-29-2018, 07:20 PM
philb philb is offline
 
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Default Correct again Dr. Joe!

One of the things Trump was going after in his campaign, was the lack of intergovernmental cooperation on patents, and copyrights. Our system is very different from other nations. Most countries do not understand our system of investment and rewards. Several countries refer to R&D as Rip Off & Duplicate. Some countries think we are just plain stupid. Deception is an art form and highly prized skill. Thus -- we lose and never regain our intellectual property. As a nation we will be considered mature when we cease with the presumption that everyone on earth thinks like us, and wants the same things as we want. By our standards patent infringement is a big deal and wrong. Kind of hard when someone else is using a different playbook. In the world stage national leaders will change when they see benefit to change. No president is going to place his people at a competitive disadvantage, without a sizable gain for someone like himself. Until that time companies will just have to stay ahead in the thinking department.

I hope you can see that it is not an issue of "I don't care" it is an issue of don't throw your working capital down a rat hole. Don't fight a losing war.
Not sure if that clarifies the situation any, but it is the uneven field upon which we play.
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  #8  
Old 01-29-2018, 08:03 PM
Dino Dino is offline
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hi guys.
The best thing to do is keep inventing better tools and
use the first round of copy-cats as an intent to copy all your ideas and sue for few time more the damages...

I'm starting a new company while making ez better.
With many new inventions and products for the broader market and not only woodworking. Ez is receiving a huge upgrade in function, ease and capabilities.

The new company is going to deal with all copy-cats...
Kreg-Festool-Dewalt-Truetrac and even the Chinese guys.
until then...let them do some leg-work like we did for almost 20 years.

About the new company.... Plenty of room for partners in all faces.
over 50 new tools- concepts tested and under development.
the EZ Pyramid is an example.


ezsmart@gmail.com
always available for the members.

thanks.
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  #9  
Old 01-29-2018, 09:11 PM
Absinthe Absinthe is offline
 
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There is much to be said for standards. I am not sure about this statement but I believe all the different brans of plunge saws that have tracks all use just slightly different track. As I see it each track is just a slightly different shape if aluminum extrusion. With spot on aluminum around $1.02 the cost of large scale production should be minimal.

The self squaring aspect of the connectors in some configuration was a brilliance that seems to have been abandoned since the video was made. That was a huge plus. Very little of the other tools will even have something that attaches to their tracks short of a clamp. I think the ball was really dropped when that design was abandoned in favor of one that used many multiple angles and is damn near impossible to square without a tool or more. DIno when you affixed the fence tightened it up make a line and loosen and flip it over and make a new line showing a perfect parallel line I was amazed. I kind of expected that when I bought the cabinet maker... unfortunately not.

I have bought into this idea and this system, but I recognize that once something gets standardized and there are third parties making accessories for it not only does my price go down but the usage and quality will go up.

I am investing further in the line as I just bought the bridge and will dedicate a table to it. It would appear that a dedicated piece of track is what is necessary to make this work best. It just doesn't seem like things will work well enough to take it apart and get it put back together and aligned consistently.

I would live to see much more sales of this product line. Beyond better pricing, there would be an interesting secondary market. I would so love to find stuff used.. but hopefully that will come in time.

For now, my next few projects will likely to make a compatible MDF track so I can experiment with some things that won't require me to disassemble my working tools. Followed by a compatible base so I can get my other 3 saws to be usable ... since it is practically impossible to reuse these plastic bases between saws conveniently.

Please don't take these as complaints. Just frustrated that I can't play and experiment more with the convenience of consistency.

BTW, 2 small holes precisely perpendicular to the edge of the guide would allow a pair of registration pins to set things parallel. I am still scared to screw up my existing track to try it, but soon enough I will figure out a way.
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  #10  
Old 01-31-2018, 03:45 PM
Wendell Terrell Wendell Terrell is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Marietta, Ga.
Posts: 14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philb View Post
One of the things Trump was going after in his campaign, was the lack of intergovernmental cooperation on patents, and copyrights. Our system is very different from other nations. Most countries do not understand our system of investment and rewards. Several countries refer to R&D as Rip Off & Duplicate. Some countries think we are just plain stupid. Deception is an art form and highly prized skill. Thus -- we lose and never regain our intellectual property. As a nation we will be considered mature when we cease with the presumption that everyone on earth thinks like us, and wants the same things as we want. By our standards patent infringement is a big deal and wrong. Kind of hard when someone else is using a different playbook. In the world stage national leaders will change when they see benefit to change. No president is going to place his people at a competitive disadvantage, without a sizable gain for someone like himself. Until that time companies will just have to stay ahead in the thinking department.

I hope you can see that it is not an issue of "I don't care" it is an issue of don't throw your working capital down a rat hole. Don't fight a losing war.
Not sure if that clarifies the situation any, but it is the uneven field upon which we play.
I can understand that to a degree, but it would seem that the powers that be would at least acknowledge that a member of the forum, who cares about the
product line, had taken the time to try and give them a heads up. I had provided links to all the products, sent them to both Dino and Customer service, and still, even requesting to be kept informed, never was contacted. Don't get me wrong, I use the EZ products nearly everyday and am always trying to spread the DEADWOOD concept to all the woodworkers I know. I hope EZ continues to grow and provide new products!
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