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  #1  
Old 06-25-2014, 04:22 AM
digital digital is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Branson Mo
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Default Cutting backwards ?s

Hi

I have found that if i cut backwards (put the saw over in front of the wood and then pull it back into me) I get much better clean cuts on the surface of my birch wood with the saw going the other direction.

When pushing the saw into the wood i get a lot of small ripped out edges just enough that i can not use the wood like that. I have messed up a lot of wood doing this. Because i am putting images on the wood i can not have any parts of the wood edge ripped out or having any problems.

I can turn the wood over upside down but many times i have a pattern or image all ready on the wood i need to cut out so i need to have this face up and i need the best cleanest cuts on the top.

Is is safe to cut backwards i have had the saw come up out of the track once doing it this way. Any other way to do this that would be better.??

I am thinking it is time to get a new saw blade to - what would be a very good blade for cutting Birch as clean as possible??

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 06-25-2014, 09:42 AM
Jim Pierson Jim Pierson is offline
 
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Location: Saranac Lake, NY
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I noticed on your repeat cut post that you set up to have your keeper on the right side of a right hand blade. Consider setting up to have your keeper under the bridge. The plastic strip on the track should prevent the chipping you are experiencing by supporting the wood where the blade exits the cut. The saw plate also has a slot for the (AC-1?) device that the forward part of the blade rotates through. This block is cut during the initial setup and you can have several to match different blades, same thing with the plastic strip in the track. You can have matching sets for each blade/saw combination that would provide the zero clearance support you need for glue quality jointed edges. Each EZ base comes with the insert that is flat for off-track work and the insert that is approzimately 1/2 inch deep that matches the thickness of the track.

The reason you blade is climbing on the backwards cut is the blade is rotating down toward the work as the blade makes contact with the work; unless you keep sufficient downward pressure, the blade will not only climb the work but want to advance toward YOU at a great rate. This is unsafe and not recommended practice. The deadwood concept relies on the rotation of the blade assisting in trapping the work between the saw base and table since front of the blade is rotating up from the bottom of the work toward the saw base. This is why the plastic strip on the track and the plastic insert on the saw work together to support both sides of the cut as the blade exits the wood thereby reducing the probability of chipping.

Hope this explanation helps. And welcome to the forum.
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  #3  
Old 06-25-2014, 10:50 AM
Goblu Goblu is offline
 
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Location: Michigan
Posts: 482
Cool

Welcome to the forum.

To echo the previous post by Jim, it's just not safe. The only time I'd climb cut is when trimming the antichip edge, but that's not a piece of wood and it's attached to the rail. Still needs care, though.

If you are using a 24T blade, you may want to try a 40T. I get good cuts with that. I'm in the process of trying a Tenryu blade based on this discussion of saw blades:
http://tracksawforum.com/showthread.php?t=2867

If you look at the last page there are some links to the specific blade discussed there. I found this blade to be about the same price as a Diablo 40T blade at Home Depot. The Diablo is what I have been using with "good enough" results. But I want jointer smooth edges if possible so I can do glueups after cutting.

Eventually, I may get a more expensive blade than the Tenryu, like those Philb discusses in the thread, but right now this one is more in my budget and I'm still a new woodworker.

Two other general things to check are that your blade does not wobble and your sawbase is installed dead square to the blade on your saw. Also, there's little learning curve on using the tracksaw.
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  #4  
Old 06-25-2014, 03:22 PM
digital digital is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Branson Mo
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i AM NOT QUITE UNDERSTANDING THIS
I am cutting on the side with the plastic strip ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Pierson View Post
I noticed on your repeat cut post that you set up to have your keeper on the right side of a right hand blade. Consider setting up to have your keeper under the bridge. The plastic strip on the track should prevent the chipping you are experiencing by supporting the wood where the blade exits the cut. The saw plate also has a slot for the (AC-1?) device that the forward part of the blade rotates through. This block is cut during the initial setup and you can have several to match different blades, same thing with the plastic strip in the track. You can have matching sets for each blade/saw combination that would provide the zero clearance support you need for glue quality jointed edges. Each EZ base comes with the insert that is flat for off-track work and the insert that is approzimately 1/2 inch deep that matches the thickness of the track.

The reason you blade is climbing on the backwards cut is the blade is rotating down toward the work as the blade makes contact with the work; unless you keep sufficient downward pressure, the blade will not only climb the work but want to advance toward YOU at a great rate. This is unsafe and not recommended practice. The deadwood concept relies on the rotation of the blade assisting in trapping the work between the saw base and table since front of the blade is rotating up from the bottom of the work toward the saw base. This is why the plastic strip on the track and the plastic insert on the saw work together to support both sides of the cut as the blade exits the wood thereby reducing the probability of chipping.

Hope this explanation helps. And welcome to the forum.
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  #5  
Old 06-25-2014, 04:32 PM
Goblu Goblu is offline
 
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digital, you can cut with the keeper piece held under the track or the waste piece held under the track. The plastic antichip edge (ACE) will help protect the under-the-track piece from chipping. So some people put the keeper piece under the track. Not always possible depending on the wood size, logistics, etc. And yes, you always cut on one side of the track, usually using the ACE. (except bevel cuts that don't use it, etc).

The plastic ACE edge marks the cut line of the saw.
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  #6  
Old 06-28-2014, 02:37 PM
digital digital is offline
 
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Location: Branson Mo
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OO ok i see i would need to feed it in the other way i will try that as i am getting a lot of wood chipping right now unless i go backwards.

I will have to move my setup as i do not have much space on the right side to feed in larger sheets. I am starting with 4x8 or 5x5 sheets.
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  #7  
Old 06-28-2014, 03:54 PM
Jim Pierson Jim Pierson is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digital View Post
OO ok i see i would need to feed it in the other way i will try that as i am getting a lot of wood chipping right now unless i go backwards.

I will have to move my setup as i do not have much space on the right side to feed in larger sheets. I am starting with 4x8 or 5x5 sheets.
Digital,
Feeding a full 4x8 sheet through EZ-One can be done as long as you are performing a cross-cut (4ft long) cut first. I would suggest have someone assist or rig some stands to help stabilize the sheet on top of the table. A 4x8 sheet can be difficult to handle and could lead to injury by forcing awkward lifts or twists; and that is before you even pull the trigger to start the saw! If you are working alone I would remove the track from the B-300 and lay the track on-top of the sheet and reduce the size of the panel to a more manageable overall size. This is where the MFT comes in, the sliding and rotating sacrificial boards expand the EZ-1 providing more support. If you don't have this option, lay a sacrificial surface below the sheet (lots of people use insulated foam board. Another alternative to to set the sheet on 2x4 sleepers and align the cut edge to miss the sleepers. If you own the UEG or ripsizer these are very useful for reducing the size of the sheet goods. There are lots of way to accomplish a task. Just think through what needs to happen, how it get set up for safety, then make the cut.

Just a hint; you should not trust the factory edge as straight and the corners square. Make a very light trim cut to set up a reference edge and make all future measurements from that edge and work your way around to being square.

Have fun, start with basic cuts and go from there.

Jim
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  #8  
Old 06-28-2014, 06:05 PM
jgowrie jgowrie is offline
 
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I have to say that any attempt to run a circular saw backwards through material sounds like a recipe to real trouble... Severe personal injury being the main concern here.

Definitely figure out how to support your sheets properly if you are using the EZ-1 as your main tool to break down sheet goods. It's too narrow to support the over hang of a sheet of plywood. Even if you were to cut the sheet into 4x4 halves your going to have issues with fall off on once side and then the piece left under the bridge is going to want to tip the EZ-1 on it's side. I would suggest at least 3 but preferably 4-5 feet of additional support on either side of the EZ-1.
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Last edited by jgowrie; 06-28-2014 at 06:16 PM.
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  #9  
Old 06-28-2014, 10:35 PM
sean9c sean9c is offline
 
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As has already been said cutting by pulling the saw towards you is dangerous. If you're not getting essentially splinter free cuts you should check your blade and anti chip edges. You can also just cut your material with the good side down. You'll get the same result as you're getting now by cutting backwards with the good side up.
You also mention that you're cutting birch, I'm assuming it's ply. Some imported (cheap) birch ply seems to have pretty brittle fiber and can be a bit of a challenge.
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  #10  
Old 06-29-2014, 03:12 PM
digital digital is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Branson Mo
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I am using a adjustable roller stand to help stabilize the sheet and i make a cut in around the center to half it and then work with each half not the full sheet after the first cut.

I will get a new blade soon waiting on a reply form a member here on some info on a pro blade.

Thinking about adding some kind of bottom plastic or something to capture all the saw dust that gets shot down words.
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