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Old 08-21-2009, 07:58 AM
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Default Edges with a 5008 - Denise Ohio

Okay, I am very tired so if what I write makes no sense, that is totally my fault.

I finally have put my new 5008 to work to build two washstand style bath vanities. The front dust port has helped keep the dust down to a reasonable level (thank you, Dino), but I noticed the edges on the maple I've been cutting don't quite have the finished look that my old saw would give me when using the EZ rails.

In fact, they look a lot like what I get from my Jet tablesaw (quel horreur! a tablesaw! what can I be thinking?).

The blade on the 5008 is a 24T Makita that probably came with the saw, while my old saw has the Freud (I think Freud? it's the red one you always recommend) 40T. I have an extra 40T blade (7 1/2 or 7 1/4, I can't remember which).

Yes, I could just swap the blades and see for myself if that solves the problem, but I already admitted that I am very tired. And if the blade isn't the problem, then what did I screw up? See, tomorrow when I go to troubleshoot, I like to have a list of options to try. Otherwise I get all confused when the first option doesn't work and then I swear a lot.

Anyway, I waxed the rail to make sure everything is gliding along. The 5008 is seated properly on the rail (and thank you whoever came up with the blue tape trick for those plastic insert thingies. That works like a charm.), and I'm moving the saw forward at a slow and steady pace.

Any ideas on how I can get better edges?

Oh, and an advance warning---I have many, many more questions coming regarding my nemesis, the SRK, regarding tenons, T&G, and other assorted fun do-jobbies.

Many thanks.

P.S. My house is coming along. We're finally to the finishing stage, so I have my usual old growth fir and western red cedar, as well as big leaf maple, cherry, and black walnut. The cherry and black walnut---well, there's a story about how I got this material but I need to take a shower and have a cocktail and maybe I will tell the story later.
  #2  
Old 08-21-2009, 07:59 AM
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Default Dino Makropoulos

Hi Denise.
Long time...

See if the smart base is properly installed.
Yes, I know...but this is the first thing to remove from your list.
See if the blade is parallel to the slot.

Make sure you have the AC-2 installed.
That helps with the stability.

The stock Makita blade is OK.,,but you never know.
  #3  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:00 AM
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Default Burt Waddell

Denise,

Also, it might just be the wood. I use a lot of maple and you can never be quiet sure what it will do next whether it is with the EZ or a table saw.

Burt
  #4  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:00 AM
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Default Randal Stevenson

Dino, Burt,

Have either of you noticed any issues with grain direction when cutting? Any woods worse then others for it?

Thanks
  #5  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:01 AM
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Default Burt Waddell

Randal,

No issues as it relates to ease of cut but there are definitely differences in quality of rip cuts with some woods. Maple is worst and it seems to be more in the softer portions of the wood. It really doesn't create a working problem but is something I notice from time to time.

Also maple seems to have more tension in the wood in general - you can cut a board and then it bows. I've ripped maple on a table saw with a stock feeder and seen a board have so much tension in it that it knocked one of the old jet lock fences out of adjustment when the tension released.

Burt
  #6  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:02 AM
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Default Look at maple funny and it will twist on you - Denise Ohio

Maple is just like that and one of the reasons I'd rather work it EZ-ily is because of the safety in dealing with material that has a mind of it's own.

I'll grab some cedar and fir and rip using the same set up, comparing the cuts from the 5008 and my old PC Mag. If there's a significant difference, then I'll start taking things apart, trying different rails, etc. I usually cut things a bit wide and long, and finish up with a pass through the planer, so the blade marks are already gone on the washstand legs, but I was surprised when I saw them. I've ripped some pretty skanky material and have ended up with nice clean edges using the PC Mag, no problem.

I can't test this morning as Catherine will be gone and we have a rule: no using power tools or going up scaffolding/ladders if no one else is here. I am allowed to use the planer.

I do a lot of sweeping in these situations.

I'll check back once I've investigated. If you hear crying and swearing later this afternoon coming from Western Washington, that will be me.
  #7  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:04 AM
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Default Okay, I did my tests... - Denise Ohio

Between my PC Mag and the 5008. The PC Mag doesn't have an AC-2 (I can't remember where I put 'em), but I went ahead.

First rips on maple using the same rail I have been using. Same result---both saws definitely showed blade marks on the edge of the material. Not even close to a finished edge.

I swapped rails. Second rips on maple resulted in better edges, but still not finish level. The PC Mag's results looked better, even without the AC-2.

I swapped material. Third rips on cedar. The PC Mag's result was better than the 5008. The PC Mag gave me finished edges, while the 5008 showed saw blade marks.

Conclusions:

1. The first rail I was using may have something going on with it. I've used the rails a lot in all sorts of conditions, often as guide rails for 2x material with either the PC Mag off the rails or to guide my Bigfoot. Perhaps I bent the rail or did something else to it. It looks okay, but honestly, I didn't put it up against a straight edge or anything. I'll check that tomorrow.

2. Somethings up with the 5008. How do I go about checking/fixing the Smart Base?
  #8  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:05 AM
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Default Burt Waddell

Suggestions:

1. Take the blade off the PC Mag and put it on the 5008 (I know the blade on the Mag is a 7 1/4" but that will be fine.) Try a cut with the 7 1/4" on the 5008. If the cut is okay, the blade you currently have on the mag is the problem.

Also, you may have a 40 tooth blade on the Mag and a 24 tooth blade on the 5008. Under those circumstances, the mag should show a better cut.

2. If the cut on the 5008 with the blade from the Mag is still bad check the alignment of the blade to the smart base. Mark a tooth on the blade on the 5008. move that tooth to either the front or back of the smart base. Measure from the slot for the rail on the smart base to the tooth you marked. Then move the tooth to the other end of the smart base and repeat the measurement. These two measurements should be the same. If they're not the same adjust the smart base to get them to the same measurement and this should solve your problem.

3. If you still have a problem, Try pulling and pushing on the edge and see if there is any movement in the arbor bearing. If there is movement, your saw is defective.

4. If you still have a problem and there is no movement in the bearing, call Dino, Dik or anyone you would like because I have no idea what is happening.

Burt
  #9  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:05 AM
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Default Thanks, Burt - Denise Ohio

Will try all.
  #10  
Old 08-21-2009, 08:06 AM
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Default Dik Harrison

Denise,

Are the tooth marks on the top edge of the cut face? are they made by the leading or trailing tooth cut, or both. If trailing, the marks should curve down and toward the direction of cut. if leading they should be down and curved toward the beginning of the cut. With my Worx, I get trailing marks when ripping oak with my 40 tooth Freud blade. I think it has to do with the saw laboring some and the blade flexing, but I also suspect that there is a mis-adjustment in the base that I can't seem to see or measure.
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