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  #11  
Old 04-28-2014, 09:22 AM
TooManyToys TooManyToys is offline
 
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Location: Jersey Shore (Not Seaside!)
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I break off Kregs screws as well, PITA. My worst nightmare was installing Rosewood stair treads and I ended up grinding down the heads of GRK cabinet screws, not something you want to do on a regular basis.

If I was going to commercially use dowels so I could justify the cost I would buy Mafell's dual dowel tool.

I've got the PC biscuit cutter but use the Festool 20x more.
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  #12  
Old 04-28-2014, 10:02 AM
jgowrie jgowrie is offline
 
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Location: Suffern, NY
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I've never had trouble with Kreg screws breaking.. are you using impact driver or a standard driver with clutch engaged?
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  #13  
Old 04-28-2014, 10:28 AM
bumpnstump bumpnstump is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lexington, Ky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goblu View Post
Rick, have you ever used the quickscrews pocket hole screws? What did you think about them vs the Kreg screws? I'm asking because I've had some trouble with the Kreg screws breaking off. Not to save money but to increase quality. Great method of making the PH plugs and also how to best glue them, etc.

Also, great to hear your method of using the cabinet maker with biscuits.
Katie,
not sure what brand of pocket screws I'm currently using; I'm still going thru a large box of 'no-name' brand I bought a few years ago. I've never had any pocket screws break. Perhaps you might want to run your own experiment and get some from the different suppliers? (McFeelys, CSH Hardware, Quickscrews, etc.) Good possibility they all get them from the same Chinese suppliers....
Rick
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  #14  
Old 04-28-2014, 01:19 PM
jkr jkr is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Western Mass
Posts: 21
Default flush cutting dowels and possibly kreg plugs

While I haven't had the need to cut the plugs for kreg pocket holes, I've had to flush cut a number of dowel mistakes. (Dowelmax, and the mistakes were all mine.) I had difficulty not damaging the wood surrounding the misplaced dowels. I bought a flush cut saw from Lee Valley, and have had great success with it. They have a variety to choose from, with a section in their index for flush cut saws. I'm sure other vendors have similar saws.
Maybe the angle of the kreg plugs will make it more difficult to achieve the same results, but I think it should work ok. I could check it over the weekend if needed.
Judd
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  #15  
Old 04-28-2014, 08:51 PM
Europa Europa is offline
 
Join Date: May 2012
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Do any of you have experience with the Mortise Pal for loose tenon joints? It looks well engineered and fairly straightforward in set up. (It appears to have a dowel version too.)
Thanks, john
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  #16  
Old 04-28-2014, 08:51 PM
Vondoom88 Vondoom88 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Nowheresville, IL
Posts: 278
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Rick,
No apology needed, you among many others(Burt,Dik etc.) on here are a wealth of info! For me the seasoned veterans like you are the reason I kept lurking around here before I bought my EZ stuff and you guys are the reason I keep coming back. I have no formal training, no shop classes no nothing. No family members or friends that are into this stuff to the extent I'd like to get into so your info, tips tricks & just general how to tackle this is awesome.

Yeah regarding plugs I just bought a 3/8" dowel rod. Just cut it into pieces glued them in than cut them off with a hand saw.

Dowelmax has lowered the price on the classic kit its 249.00 now, not cheap but in spitting distance of the jessem paralign unit. I guess just over 300.00 with the 1/4" bushings. I don't see the need for the 1/2" dowel at least for me anyway.

Regarding the biscuit jointer I borrowed it from my boss who doesn't use it much anymore. I've only tried one project with it. I had a couple misaligned biscuits but they were definitely my fault. I found the machine hard to use probably just because I'm new to it. I downloaded the pdf file Katie posted & I might revisit the biscuit jointer again.

Watching the videos of the either dowel jig the dowelmax or the jessem unit they just seem faster and more straight forward to me. Like I said I like the pocket hole jig but plugging them holes sucks IMO.
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  #17  
Old 04-28-2014, 09:14 PM
TooManyToys TooManyToys is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgowrie View Post
I've never had trouble with Kreg screws breaking.. are you using impact driver or a standard driver with clutch engaged?
Both John.

Typically I use my 12vdc impact driver. Spending 30 years in Automotive R&D I understand the issue with an impact wrench and fasteners. I usually do what your not supposed to, throttle back the trigger when using smaller diameter screws. It has been very rare that I strip or break a deck, structural or cabinet screw. The Kregs broke easily for me and may have been adversely effected by the Rosewood. Switched over to the clutched 18vdc drill and still broke a few. When to GRK cabinet screws after grinding down the heads to fit the Kreg holes and none broke, drill or impact.
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  #18  
Old 04-28-2014, 10:00 PM
bumpnstump bumpnstump is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooManyToys View Post
Both John.

Typically I use my 12vdc impact driver. Spending 30 years in Automotive R&D I understand the issue with an impact wrench and fasteners. I usually do what your not supposed to, throttle back the trigger when using smaller diameter screws. It has been very rare that I strip or break a deck, structural or cabinet screw. The Kregs broke easily for me and may have been adversely effected by the Rosewood. Switched over to the clutched 18vdc drill and still broke a few. When to GRK cabinet screws after grinding down the heads to fit the Kreg holes and none broke, drill or impact.
Jack, I used to use my impacter, but changed to just using the drill (w/out the clutch) and I've gotten better results.
I decided to use the drill, instead of impactor, after an interesting discovery using the deck screws from http://www.splitstop.com/
I initially used the drill w/the splitstops and was totally enthralled w/how the screws did their thing. Later, after getting an impactor and using it w/the screws, the performance went way down. Took me a while to consider going back to the drill, but when I did, problem solved!
I next applied the impactor-to-drill change when driving pocket screws, and there is a noticeable difference for me. Guess it has something to do w/the fluid, continuous motion of the drill vs. the 'hammering' of the impactor. Whatever it was, it works.
UMMV,
Rick

Last edited by bumpnstump; 04-28-2014 at 10:05 PM.
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  #19  
Old 04-29-2014, 01:18 AM
philb philb is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 165
Post Setting the record straight.

I want to be clear. I am biased. I understand and do not deny it. The actual truth is that there are very few tools that work for everybody right out of the box. That is one of the reasons we have had the problems we have with new EZ users. Some people adapt and some do not. There is nothing wrong with the person, and nothing wrong with the tools. Most teachers can explain this in great detail, but everyone processes information differently. Everyone has a different method of learning, even though there are 4 basic learning styles.

So all of that stated, it is not really any surprise when one person has trouble learning or mastering a tool or process. Thank God there are so many options, and no single best way. I like the dowels and Dowelmax. Some like the biscuit cutter and biscuits. Some like to spend countless hours cutting dovetails and M&T joints. It is a personal style thing.

My kitchen cabinets are falling apart and it is time to build some more. The ones that are here are absolute junk from a woodworkers point. The cheapest materials, and the cheapest construction methods. Yet we have had these cabinets for over 40 years. Not really a surprise that they are falling apart -- I just paid off the mortgage last year. Obviously the materials and methods were good enough.

My point is that there is no one best way. If someone does not like using dowels they are not stupid or a bad woodworker -- in my opinion they are just different from me and working in a style they want to work in to make the best product they can! I do not believe that anyone wants to make a bad product. We all have the same goal, just different ways of getting there. I was concerned that some members were afraid of saying something counter to what I have stated. Have at it! State your opinions, as long as they are not in violation of the terms of use. Stay polite, and disagree if you wish. I will not call you a nincompoop -- even if it is true -- because you have the right to work the way that is best for you. This is a great list, and we will only stay that way if all the possible ideas are examined.
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  #20  
Old 04-30-2014, 03:43 AM
Goblu Goblu is offline
 
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Location: Michigan
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I never use the impact driver with pockethole screws, and rarely use it when I'm making furniture for regular screws. I'd use it for 2x4s, or putting up curtain rods, things like that. It's too easy to wreck a piece of cherry or maple. The last time a ph screw broke I was babying it along, trying not to crack the wood. I've read some folks saying that the Kreg screws are not as good as they used to be, breakages and stripping are more common. Not surprising, if so, since few things are as well made as they used to be.
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